OK, I actually already commented this in the advanced d20 characters thread, but how does one actually get killed in combat?
I understand the conditions, but are there still hit points involved too?
Also, the attack bonus is confusing. Is it the only thing that the character (disregarding situational modifiers) has to add to the d20 roll to attack?. What function do the weapon group checks have then?
Thanks for the feedback. Hit points are gone the way of the dodo, using instead a save-turned-defense called toughness to let you know how far down the condition track you are. Death and dying come into play after being dropped by a weapon of the appropriate descriptor (and if I haven’t added that sidebar about death/dying and descriptor based damage, I’ll add that to my to-do list).
Attack bonus is being revised as we speak. Right now, an attack roll is:
d20 + Ranks in the relevant weapon group vs. Target’s Dodge
So if you’re a swordsman, you might bave 6 ranks in Weapon Group (Swords). Your attack would be 6+1d20. Base attack bonus and the like are gone.
And the wiki still needs a lot of work, I’ll admit. Expect revision soon when I get my act together and start brute-forcing through edits.
Folding attacks and defenses under skills creates an issue. All other skill ranks are purchased at 1 character point per 4 skill ranks. This now applies to all the skills except the weapon groups and the defenses, which can be confusing just on principle. I’m not sure what the solution is unless you create a subset of Combat Skills, which don’t follow the regular skill rules, but that’s not really much different from keeping the Combat Abilities separate from the skill structure to begin with. Obviously it doesn’t make much sense for every skill rank to cost one character point. And making the attack and defense bonuses purchasable on a 1:4 basis doesn’t work either… Any other ideas?
All skills cost 1 cp. I’m taking into account the old pricing by altering what you’re getting for your 1 cp:
Old Attack: 2 cp/+1 bonus to all attacks
New Attack: 1 cp/+1 bonus to all attacks with weapons from a given weapon group
Old Defense: 2 cp/+1 bonus to defense, half of which is lost when flat-footed
New Defense: 1 cp/+1 bonnus to Dodge, which is lost when flat-footed (just like old Dodge Focus feat… and it can be bought up to not be lost with the Defensive Focus feat [which I need to post when I write it])
Old Skill: 1/4 cp/+1 bonus to a narrow skill
New Skill: 1 cp/+1 bonus to a broad skill (similar in breadth to old skill groups
Anyway, to me it seems that the attack bonus is not so powerful as in d&d since armor does not add to defenses. The default assumption seems to allow hitting a comparable level foe always with less than 20. In d&d AC can be ridiculously high, making attack bonus valuable in a way, since without high enough bonus the foe is almost invincible. Pricing attack bonus +1 per level should be a decent idea together with the skill group (+1 per 1 point) since the plain attack bonus is not so critical.
I still think some kind of specialising is nice for weapons, and why not skills as well. This is to give some chances for characters to stand out in one narrow field. That should be easy to do with some feats that allow you to exceed the max bonus for a single skill application/weapon by +1 or +2. If you want to hold on to the max bonus to be absolutely the max, you could allow the bonus from the feat only for cancelling penalties related to the check.
I was skeptical about a hard bonus too, Rothe. But I’ve found that in the end, it really does wonders for keeping things on a level playing field, and I still get to have my geeky fun building characters in ways that get them to those caps well. And if you really want to shine in an area, that’s what trade-offs are for. For example, if you want a Bruteish character who does lots of damage but swinngs clumsily, you can take a -attack/+damage trade-off. And as for specializing in a narrow area, you can achieve that with the (upcoming) Skill Focus feat, which grants a +4 bonus to a specific use of a specific skill (such as a +4 bonus to hiding with Infiltration, or a +4 bonus to Intimidating with Persuasion.
Attack bonuses are about as defense bonuses in a generic sense. Armor actually adds to toughness under this system, and shields add to dodge, but there are other ways to get your defense up (the Shield FX, for instance).
How is it with the skill feats then, if you get +4 to hiding with infiltration, can you exceed the hard cap for skill bonus at your power level when hiding? If not, the feat could put you in a funny situation where you “waste” the feat if you raise your infiltration while your power level stays put.
For example you cap hiding with the feat, but your infiltration skill is 4 less. Then you would not get the full benefit from raising infiltration if the cap stays, since the hide part would be exceeding the cap.
Maybe the solution would be that you can allow the exceeding part to cancel penalties to the check, this way the contests of skill will still both use the capped skills - you still get benefits if circumstances give penalty.
All skills cost 1 cp. I’m taking into account the old pricing by altering what you’re getting for your 1 cp:
Old Attack: 2 cp/+1 bonus to all attacks
New Attack: 1 cp/+1 bonus to all attacks with weapons from a given weapon group
Old Defense: 2 cp/+1 bonus to defense, half of which is lost when flat-footed
New Defense: 1 cp/+1 bonnus to Dodge, which is lost when flat-footed (just like old Dodge Focus feat… and it can be bought up to not be lost with the Defensive Focus feat [which I need to post when I write it])
Old Skill: 1/4 cp/+1 bonus to a narrow skill
New Skill: 1 cp/+1 bonus to a broad skill (similar in breadth to old skill groups
How is it with the skill feats then, if you get +4 to hiding with infiltration, can you exceed the hard cap for skill bonus at your power level when hiding? If not, the feat could put you in a funny situation where you “waste” the feat if you raise your infiltration while your power level stays put.
For example you cap hiding with the feat, but your infiltration skill is 4 less. Then you would not get the full benefit from raising infiltration if the cap stays, since the hide part would be exceeding the cap.
Maybe the solution would be that you can allow the exceeding part to cancel penalties to the check, this way the contests of skill will still both use the capped skills - you still get benefits if circumstances give penalty.
It’s still a hard cap. And it’s not really a situation that would ever occur (and hasn’t ever occured before in my experience with the point-buy system this is based on… why would you put your points somewhere that wouldn’t benefit you? Once you’ve reached your cap, it’s a better idea to put your points somewhere that will benefit you, rather than “wasting” points for nothing. Remember, you’re always free to choose where to put points… there’s nothing “pushing” your abilities up the way the level-based system in D&D does.
Ah, I think I see how you’re looking at it. You’re looking at the cap and wondering, “But what if I want my stealth expert to be even stealthier than that, so he really is the best?”
Under this system, the World’s Best Stealth Expert is at his cap. Most people probably won’t even approach it. Maxing out skills other than the few essential combat skills is something of a rarity.
The system already allows for a degree of “Really Really Goodness” in the form of the Skill Mastery feat, which lets you pick a handful of skills you can always take 10 on.
