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Character for a ‘flying challenge’
Posted: 25 March 2008 03:52 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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Level 9
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I’m thinking of participating in a small encounter challenge where the DM sets four characters up against a monster (or monsters) which is flying. Yep, it’s still pretty imprecise, but we know that we’re up against (a) flying monster(s).

Everything and all books allowed, but:
Powergaming allowed, munchkinism and abuses aren’t. So I’m looking for a powerful build with the following guideline:

- 32 point buy
- all WotC 3.5 material
- 8th level (including any LA, racial HD, etc)
- standard gold for 8th level (27k I think)
- setting is tundra (ie: above a tundra wink )

My thoughts so far were:
- raptoran ‘something’
- pixie rogue 3 / something x
- druid with flying companion and flying wild shape
- wizard specializing on ray spells to deal ability damage to the creature (with rods of empower / maximize)

I know the choice would depend on what the other players make and if it’s really just one opposing monster (which I think) or more - but if you’ve got interesting (and powerful) ideas off the top of your heads, I’d love to hear some. smile

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Posted: 25 March 2008 07:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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One idea would be a Dragonborn of Bahamut from Races of the Dragon, with the wings option. Among the best races to use for that would be a Water Orc (UA), though it could be considered “munchkinism” due to the fact that all the undesirable orc traits will be lost but the ability score adjustments would stay. Go Fighter 8 with Brutal Throw (CV), Weapon Focus/Specialization: Javelin, Quick Draw, Ranged Weapon Mastery, Point-Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, and Improved Flight (RotW). Another idea would be to make a Barbarian/Frenzied Berserker and use the Dive Attack ability from the Dragonborn’s winged aspect with Power Attack. If your opponent(s) use wings to fly, you could use nets and/or tanglefoot bags to cause them to plummet to the ground for falling damage. Another trick that’s sure to be disallowed would be to throw some Dust of Sneezing and Choking onto them (DMG, cursed items).

If you have Frostburn, check some of the specialized spellcaster feats for cold climates. Snowcasting, Frozen Magic, and Cold Spell Specialization are great to have if you’re adventuring exclusively in a cold climate. A Wizard 5/ Frost Mage 3 would be a decent choice, and remember that with Snowcasting any of your spells can benefit from Frozen Magic and Cold Spell Specialization, even if they don’t deal cold damage. Wizard 3/ Master Specialist 3/ Frost Mage 2 would also be a decent choice if you’re going to be relying on high save DCs, as you can apply (greater) Cold Focus to any spell cast with Snowcasting as well. Get a Decanter of Endless Water and, according to Frostburn page 10, second paragraph under “Hypothermia” states that the DC of all Fortitude saves to resist any cold effect or spell (i.e. any spell cast with Snowcasting) is increased by 10 until the target and its clothes become dry. So just getting them wet gives your spells with a Fort save +10 to the DC as long as you use Snowcasting to cast them, though I can’t think of any battle-winning Fort save spells available at that level off the top of my head. You may need to go Human with flaws to get enough feats to really be good in that environment.

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Posted: 25 March 2008 07:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Any kind of archer build should be pretty nice for this. You should ask the other players if they all plan to make characters that can fly. If most of the team is groundbound, you don’t really have to make a flyer.

Anyother decent option for a more fun build could be some kind of warlock, just take the flying invocation and eldritch spear to have more range.

The Obsidian Fortress: Character Status

My Lost islands PbP character:
Belthan Grayshield

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Posted: 25 March 2008 08:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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Dust of sneezing and choking is probably out - I’ll check on the water orcs. All suggestions sound good though - I’ll get back to you as soon as I’ve either made a decision or there’s more info from the DM.

Thanks!

(this doesn’t mean that I’m not curious to hear even more ideas though smile )

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Posted: 25 March 2008 09:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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I’m currently preparing the water orc and checking out his damage potential, but I had another idea - the opposing monster will have the dragon type.

What about a raptoran ranger 5 / something 3 with improved favored enemy (dragon) for +7 to damage. Then get the woodland archer feat to make sure one hits. Finally spend 95% of the money on the oathbow (DMG/SRD) and use rapid shot and all that stuff.

Heh, maybe even go pixie ranger 2 / fighter 2 and do the same?

Pixie with base Dex 17 +1 level +8 racial = 26.

To hit:
+19 (+4 BAB +8 Dex +5 enhancement)
Damage:
3d6+14 (+4 Dex +5 favored enemy +5 enhancement +2d6 bane (maybe even Str +2)) on each hit.
Survivability might be an issue with the pixie though.

Hrmmm… what does everyone think? 

Oh, and another idea… use some kind of archer build in conjunction with spell storing arrows - place ray of enfeeblement and the like on them. What was that terrific (overpowered) dex damage spell again?

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Posted: 25 March 2008 02:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Personally, I like a Ranger/Cragtop Archer Goliath.  Throw your spot as high as possible, and try to get whatever justification you can to start the fight from 1000’ away.

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Posted: 25 March 2008 02:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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Ha, nice one! The oathbow could even be a greatbow then… smile

Problem is, there might actually be a 3rd party DM (one party being the four characters and another the dragon-type-monster) who will decide on such matters. I’m rather unsure it’ll work out.

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Posted: 25 March 2008 03:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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In all fairness...how’s a flying critter supposed to sneak up on you on the Tundra?  It’s your call if you want to chance it, but given the setting and opponent, it *should* be a viable strategy.

A wizard in the party with D-Door memorized who can keep you at-range as long as possible would be a good ally.

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Posted: 25 March 2008 11:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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Hrhm… I might have to go caster afterall since there’s one winged (template) scout 5/ranger 1 (elf) and another archertype with a giant eagle as a mount. If we all make archer-types, then we won’t be very flexible I guess.

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Posted: 26 March 2008 03:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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The oathbow variant made the DM whimper. rasberry

Maybe it’ll be disallowed due to costing too much (ie: he’ll put up that common restriction that no single item may cost more than half the amount of gold one has).

Still:
With the spell Hunter’s Mercy (SC) and one pearl of power, the character could get three crits - and the oathbow has a x4 multiplier. I’ll keep you updated here - even though I’ll be off from tomorrow until Sunday and won’t be able to report any developments until then. smile

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Posted: 26 March 2008 05:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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A nonpsionic Thri-Kreen (only +1 LA instead of +2, found in MM2 and Shining South) Racial HD 2/ Monk 1/ Soulknife 2/ Soulbow 2 would be a superb choice. Get Zen Archery so Wis is your only important ability score for attack/damage/AC. Take Multiweapon Fighting (MM) and fire four Mind Arrows/round, each of which could have the Lucky property so every missed attack would have a second chance to hit. Your Weapon Focus: Mind Blade bonus feat from Soulknife will apply to Mind Arrows as well, and if you can use the variant Monk fighting styles from UA the Sleeping Tiger style would grant Weapon Finesse just in case you get into melee. With a flaw you could have enough general feats to get Vow of Poverty, which is just amazing for what’s already one of the strongest archery builds around, in which case I’d go with Noncombatant.

Since you know you’re going up against a dragon, you should probably try to make sure everyone has Evasion and good saves across the board. The Draconomicon has more than enough resources to make these critters unstoppable. With their racial Frightful Presence or the feat Awaken Frightful Presence if they’re not old enough to have it, plus a feat called Frightful Presence, and you’ll have a Shaken x2 = Frightened party from the start of combat who will all have to reattempt the saves throughout the battle until they’ve succeeded on each one. The Metabreath feats, particularly Maximize Breath and Clinging Breath, will allow it to use hit-and-run tactics to deal extraordinary amounts of damage if it makes the breath attack cling for multiple rounds. Keep in mind that the party may be fighting on a cloudy day, in fog, or even during a blinding snowstorm which has little effect on a dragon’s ability to fly but would toss smaller PCs through the air if they try to take flight. In that case, you should definitely look at some of the spells in Frostburn, particularly Snowsight (druid/ranger/winter domain 1, 1 hr/level, 50g each for potions, everyone get at least 2 in case it uses dispel).

Another option would be to stick with a winged Dragonborn but maybe not Water Orc, and go Fighter 2/ Paladin 6. Take Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Ritiik (Frostburn), Power Attack, Combat Expertise, Improved Trip, Extra Smiting (CW), and use the Charging Smite variant from PHB2. For a Dragonborn Water Orc your ability scores would probably go Str 20, Dex 10, Con 14, Int 13, Wis 12, Cha 12 after racial adjustments and both level-up points in Str. Get a +1 Valorous (UE) Ritiik (FB), or if you can’t get Valorous then probably get Lucky (XPH). Other gear will be Gloves of Str +2, Cloak of Cha +2, Vest of Resistance +2, +1 Chain Shirt, Ring of Protection +1, three 1st level Pearls of Power, and 300 gold to spend on potions, scrolls, wands (with only a few charges), tanglefoot bags, nets, etc.

You’ll probably need other party members to use nets or tanglefoot bags to keep it from flying too far away so you can spend one round flying up and another to use a Dive Attack. Power Attack two-handed for -3 to hit, combined with +8 bab, +6 str, +2 charging, +2 smite evil, and a +1 weapon will give you +16 to hit. Your 1st level spell prepared will be Rhino’s Rush (SC), which is cast as a Swift Action just before the charge. Assuming you hit, you’ll deal 1d8+1 weapon, +9 str, +6 smite evil, +12 charging smite, +6 power attack, x2 for Dive Attack, x2 for Rhino’s Rush, and x2 for Valorous for a total of x4 damage which is 4d8+136 damage. Your opponent must then make a Reflex save (DC 10 + damage dealt!) or be hooked by the Ritiik. Once hooked you get to make a free trip attempt, at a +10 bonus, which if successful gives you a free additional attack due to Improved Trip, which still has Power Attack and Charging applied but none of the smite or multiplier bonuses. Once all that is over with you can rip the Ritiik free, dealing just as much damage as the initial attack (whatever the result of the 4d8+136 was). If you fail to kill it in one attack, you simply retreat and use a Pearl of Power to recover Rhino’s Rush, then repeat the process. Don’t forget that it must save vs massive damage for both the initial attack and when ripping the weapon free.

At that level Enervation is available and is definitely a viable choice due to the low touch AC of most dragons. A Spellscale (RotD) or Human with Draconic Heritage Sorcerer with Split Ray (CA), Practical Metamagic (RotD), and Arcane Thesis (PH2) can cast a Split Ray Enervation without having to use a higher level spell slot than normal. The Metamagic Specialist variant (PH2) can be used to overcome the increased casting time several times per day. This trick is made difficult by the prerequisites of Practical Metamagic and Arcane Thesis, as neither can be taken any sooner than 6th level. Additionally, you must already be able to cast Enervation to choose it as your Arcane Thesis, but where there is a will there is a way. Upon reaching 8th level, the character could have spent years studying Enervation and learning all there was to know about it, sacrificing his physical health in the process gaining the Feeble or Frail flaw, or becoming severely near-sighted from pouring over tomes for so long gaining the Murky-Eyed flaw, or habitually becoming too focused on the task at hand gaining the Inattentive flaw, in order to develop his Arcane Thesis on Enervation at 8th level. This would enable you to cast a Split Ray Enervation every round until you run out of 4th level spells (at least 3), dealing 2d4 negative levels per round assuming both rays hit. This sort of character would be the proverbial “glass cannon” capable of dishing out massive offensive power but easily defeated by a strong counteroffensive, though your 1st through 3rd level spells will likely help out with that. The Stalwart Sorcerer variant (CM) would probably be a decent choice just for the HP bonus.

Another nasty trick would be for someone to get a Scroll of Prismatic Wall (hopefully a character who’s built to not fail at the caster level check). Ready an action for when the dragon is flying and in range. Cast the Prismatic Wall directly in front of it, and if its maneuverability is Average or worse it has no choice but to fly through the wall suffering the effects of every color. Logically this will work infallibly, but as-written it could choose to drop straight down instead of flying into the wall, though I’d at least have it make a Reflex save (at the spell’s DC) to react quickly enough to avoid it. This is entirely dependent on it both having less than Good maneuverability and lacking the feat Hover, and even then it may not be a guaranteed victory, so it may not be worth the high cost and risk of using such a high level scroll.

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Posted: 26 March 2008 05:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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Uh… well, all of that tops the oathbow-dependant build for sure. o.O

I’ll be offline from tomorrow until Sunday even and will decide on what character to take then. I’ll supply a link to the battle as well. smile

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Posted: 31 March 2008 04:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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Update:

I was actually considering the paladin/charging smite variant, but as it turns out, the ‘dragon’ will have a rather high AC.

I’m reconsidering a caster-type therefore - especially since we’ve got an archer, an eagle rider and some kind of another melee-type.

One monster. It’ll have a low ability score for sure - I’m considering trying to deal Int-/Cha-/Wis- or Dex-damage to it, checking ray spells and powers currently.

Edit: Actually ray of dizziness sounds like a good way to take out the dragon...? Sure if it has good maneuverability and or hover it might still dish out some damage, but it will be severely hampered.

[ Edited: 31 March 2008 05:09 AM by Tashalar]
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Posted: 31 March 2008 08:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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Biff - wouldn’t your illumian ultimate magus build be able to do the enervation trick though?

Just take practical metamagic, go sorcerer 1 / wizard 4 / ultimate magus 3 and with augmented casting, he can use the 1st level sorcerer slots to power the split ray level adjustment that’s left! I’ll try to see if I can put this together after all.

Ray of dizzines et al will still work as well!

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Posted: 31 March 2008 08:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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Against a dragon you could do well with a warlock using vitriolic blasts. They ignore SR, which is likely for the dragon even at that level.

Eldritch spear and vitriolic blast would be good for long distance shooting, especially against a low dexterity dragon that likely has a low touch AC. Maximize SLA is also a good addition, since it maximizes also the additional damage that the blast deals in subsequent rounds.

The Obsidian Fortress: Character Status

My Lost islands PbP character:
Belthan Grayshield

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Posted: 31 March 2008 08:45 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]  
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(actually, for the 8th level build I would not even need an illumian, right? I could go dragonborn grey elf for instance...)
Race: Illumian (naenkrau sigil)
Class: Sorcerer 1 (Stalwart sorcerer variant) / Wizard 4 / Ultimate Magus 3

Feats: Practiced Spellcaster (sorcerer), Split Ray, Practical Metamagic (split ray)

Abilities: Str 8 / Dex 16 / Con 14 / Int 18 / Wis 10 / Cha 12 (after two level-up points in Int)

Casts spell as a 9th level sorcerer and wizard.

Grey elf version:

Abilities: Str 6 / Dex 18 / Con 12 / Int 20 / Wis 10 / Cha 12

Casts spell as an 8th level sorcerer and wizard.

****

Am I missing something or can I go from here?

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