4th & Dragon : Dungeons and Dragons...and stuff

I found this article posted over at Paizo and found it a good read.  Some of it even waxes prophetic as the article was wrote back in ‘06.  Of particular interest is what Monte says about the OGL and the changes he predicts.  Much of the article makes me want to ask him questions now based on his predictions then.  ...maybe I will.

Do so.  I thought that was pretty refreshing too, but I suspect we got two fairly different things out of that.  I don’t know if this is worthy of a front page news item since it’s 2 years old, so I’ll let Jim and company determine that.

I’d seen this come up before when 4th was first announced.  Really good article.  I had forgotten about it.

I think he’s wrong on one very important point, though.  I think the fall out from tightening the OGL (into the GSL) will be good for the industry (maybe not for WotC).  I think this is going to prevent the sea of crap, and it was a vast vast ocean too, that we saw in 3rd.  It won’t (as we’ve seen) stop TPP but they’ll have to want to release something (hopefully of quality) before they jump through the hassle of the GSL or side stepping it entirely.

As an aside, I think the GSL is a good thing (though a lot don’t) as the control it demands is what is needed for a stable core.  Overall I have more confidence in D&D then I did after 3.5 shattered it.  It took some time for me to be able to say that with 4e.  It certainly isn’t the second coming of RPGs but it is something I think we needed ... more focused direction and increased stability.

Did he post anything on that 4th edition and the GSL? I would like to read what he think about it.

Lakoda, I respectfully disagree with your view on the GSL.  I do agree that it will hurt WotC but I don’t think it will be good for the D&D industry as a whole.  However, I do see it as helping companies like Paizo as it will give them the opportunity to offer an alternative system to play the same style of game with a less stringent license agreement.  That is definately something that appeals to me. 

Also, while I agree that there was a vast sea of crap that came out under the OGL I would like to add the exclusitory statement that no one bought that crap.  Think of it this way: name a crappy supliment that people DID buy and I think you just made and arguement against your own case.  If people buy it then it isn’t crap.  The market rules.  If a supliment fails then let it fail by it’s own merrits.  Know what I mean? 

Cam: I honestly think we prolly got the same thing out of it.  However, I wonder what his current opinions are regarding his previous predictions.  Being that he is now working for Paizo I could venture a guess but it is just a guess.  I’ll put it on my to do list to see if I could finagle an interview but I’m not about to do that without first knowing the Pathfinder rules and checking out some of his recent work.

Lune - 24 July 2008 12:36 PM

If a supliment fails then let it fail by it’s own merrits.  Know what I mean?

Right, but to use Cook’s own argument, after not buying crap for so long how long does it take before you stop buying all together?

I suppose you are right, but I would tolerate a hit to the industry if it yielded better and more supported (by the market) products as I think in the long term it would lead to a greater boon.

Monte was a bit more specific than that. You left out the part about buying crap from a specific publisher.  He is/was correct about that.  If a particular publisher produces nothing but crap your not going to buy from them.  That was sorta my point. 

I would tolerate the same hit if I was certain that this is what the GSL is going to accomplish but I am not convinced of that.  I think it will hurt WotC worse than the industry, but honestly maybe it will give a chance to the guys I want to win (Paizo).

He did generalized it, he mentioned the people who only buy core.  Being someone who stopped buying anything but core with 3e, because of the overwhelming amount of crap, I think it is safe to apply in a general way; albeit only in a minor way.

Either way, its all conjecture and hope anyways.  As an old coach of mine would say: “If ‘ifs’ and ‘buts’ were candy and nuts we’d all have a merry f’n christmas”.  I think that applies to GSL/OGL/WotC/D&D a lot.  I also think it will be what people make of it for themselves.

On a side note, maybe I’m missing something b/c the last D&D book I bought (prior to 4e) was 3.5 core set, but why all the love for Piazo?  Not a challenge, I honestly don’t know.  I have a real hard time trusting TPP after a lot the one’s I liked died with 3.5 or started producing crap.

The letter of the day is “C”.  “C” is for crap.

Paizo are the creative minds behind Dragon and Dungeon magazines.  They got the axe when WotC announced 4e but the people were still around.  They shifted gears, created Pathfinder magazine, modules and are now creating their own RPG.  I definately wouldn’t call Paizo’s material crap.  They have kept the same quality that they had back when they made the Dragon and Dungeon.  In fact, I think its better.  Give it a look over, see what ya think. 

Pathfinder RPG is actually free in it’s Alpha stage right now.  I’ve been reading it over the last couple days and so far like what I see.

Admittedly I never really paid any attention to Dungeon or Dragon until they were freely available as PDFs.  That’s awfully nice of WitC to treat then that way /sarcasm off.  The only product of there’s that I’ve seen was the crit decks which I didn’t much care for.  They were well done but not in the right direction for me.  But yes, I wouldn’t have called ‘em crap or splat or whatever.

Thanks for the update!